Preetham Sai P.V. shared on 16.12.2015
Sri VijaySai B.S. 's elaborate share of his experience with Bhagawan in the subtle form
I normally don't comment on these issues on Facebook, because perception, beliefs and experiences regarding the same situations can be diametrically opposite and I have no right to judge or comment about others' beliefs and experiences. However, as you have repeatedly tagged me to answer, here are my detailed views.
Yes, when Swami was in His physical body he did not endorse any mediums. However, this too was contextual and triggered by various happenings around the times of the discourses.
However, Swami never objected to Lucas Ralli, Phyllis Krystal and many other psychics conveying messages from him and even publishing them. I have not heard of Swami mentioning that He will not use another instrument after shedding His physical body.
I and all the others who have been with Swami have heard Him say "Love my uncertainty". None can say that Sathya Sai Baba will never do such kinds of things.
One thing I know is that our Lord can do anything including unpredictable ones.
What I understand from the phenomenon is that Madhusudan has automatically got the powers of clairvoyance, clairaudience and clairsentience (seeing beyond, hearing beyond and feeling beyond) and he is able to communicate with the Sukshma Shareera or the subtle body of Swami.
There are two strong sides to this issue of Swami in the subtle form. On one side you and many others are convinced that it is not Sathya Sai Baba giving instructions to Madhu and it is cheating going on there. On the other side there are many who are convinced that it is none other than our beloved Swami who is there in the subtle form.
I will state my experience, my belief and my views. I cannot answer about other people's experiences. I can only vouch for what has happened to me and my family although I will mention a few other experiences.
How do I know Madhusudan? He has been my student at Brindavan. I have taught him English during his degree. The HDFC bank he was working in is one kilometer from my home.
How did one understand Swami's Divinity in His physical form? It was through His omnipresence, omnipotence and omniscience. He also healed people and resurrected people who were dead. His love was overwhelming, transforming and soul stirring.
I have seen all these here in the subtle form. I am convinced beyond doubt that it is our dear Swami who is here minus His physical body. Just as Swami in His early days had
shown that He was the same Sai from Shirdi to Shirdi devotees, Swami in the subtle form has proved to me that He is indeed my Sweet Lord Sathya Sai who had all the attributes as before except for His physical body.
I have multiple instances of which I will narrate a few.
Muddenahalli came into limelight after Swami's first visit to Kodaikanal in the subtle form in May 2014. Swami revealed Himself to me in this form on September 18, 2011 when we had the Samarpan session at Brindavan. I wasn't able to believe it at first. My first interview lasted for about 45 minutes during which I asked many doubts and questions and asked Him to prove to me that He is indeed the same Sai and not any other spirit. I got my confirmation and reconfirmation.
He revealed to me instances that had happened when I was staying in His bedroom at Brindavan in 1994, incidents that only Swami & I knew. Madhu also told me that Swami told that when I was a little baby and I had very high fever, He had created vibhuti and put it on my head after which my fever had subsided.
This I thought was 100% inaccurate as I had not known any incident like this to have happened in my life. When I returned and asked my mother, she said that it had happened at Dharwad in Prof. Adke's house in 1971 when I had high fever during Swami's visit to Hubli-Dharwad twin towns in North Karnataka. I was stumped.
Swami in His subtle form told my father the details of how he had opened the Sathya Sai Samithi and Bhajan mandali way back in 1966 at Hubli and how only 2-3 of them used to do Nagarasankirtan early in the morning.
I will now elaborate instances where he revealed His omnipresence in His subtle form.
It was 22nd September 2011, a Thursday, 4 days after I first got introduced to the subtle form. I was still unable to completely believe and accept it. I was in a daze. I was sitting at my house in Bangalore and singing playing my harmonium. My family – parents, wife and children had gone out for a function. I was in a devotional mood on that day and I was crying while singing all the songs I had sung in Bhagavan's physical presence including 'Tu Pyar Ka Sagar" and "Hum Ko Tumse Pyar Kitna".
I suddenly remembered that I had a presentation to a corporate client on the coming Monday. I thought that "If I continue singing, then what will happen to the important presentation?" I closed the harmonium and was in the process of opening my laptop when my cell phone rang. I saw the display and realized that it was Madhu who was calling me. I received the call.
He said "Sir, I am in Raipur, Swami just now appeared to me and said give this message to VijayaSai. He asked me to write it down and I wrote it down as He dictated it. Can you write it down sir?" I said "yes" and started typing on my laptop. The message was "Why did you stop singing? I was listening to you. Why are you bothered about your business? Why fear when I am there with you? I will take care. Continue singing. I am listening." Madhu was more than 1300 kms away at a different location.
Here is another instance of omnipresence. I was talking about the power of the mind and the law of attraction to a group of people in my conference room. I mentioned to them that the mind is all powerful and through it one can use the law of attraction to attract people,
circumstances and events that can completely help us get better money, better career, better relationships, better health and better things in every walk of life because the mind was all powerful and we are like a magnet. I started giving them practical examples of the law of attraction in various areas that have happened to various people when my telephone rang.
It was Madhu who had called me. I excused myself, stepped out of the room and took the call. Madhu said "Sir, Swami has asked me to convey a message to you. He said that VijayaSai is speaking to some people that the mind is all powerful and that through the mind people can attain success in money, health, career and many material things. VijayaSai being a Sai student has forgotten the most important thing. Ask him to tell the group that through this same mind one can also realize that He or She is Divine."
On November 26th, 2011, I was at Leicester, UK, to speak in the national congregation. Brother Veeru and Kiran had organized this trip. My wife and I were put up in a hotel for the night before my talk. We looked at the window shades and curtains that were beautiful and also at the kind of TV that they had. My wife and I discussed that the curtains were beautiful and the colour combination was perfect. We also spoke about the TV set there that we had liked. We then completely forgot about our conversation.
I had my talk the next day at Leicester. After 10 – 11 talks in London, Scotland and other places, I had a talk scheduled in the Geneva Sai Center at Switzerland. After my talk there, an old woman approached me and said that Baba used to appear in front of her every other day and that He had regularly guided her. I did not actually believe in her story. I felt that she was senile and probably hallucinating. She continued telling me more of her experiences. I thought that she was mentally unstable ("Picchi" in Telugu).
When I returned on the 10th of December, Swami summoned us. My wife and I went to Madhu's house in a locality in Bangalore called Koramangala.
The conversation went thus. "How was the trip?" I said "Swami, it went wonderful with your grace. I am amazed how 2000 people can congregate for your birthday at Leicester when we can't get that done in Brindavan many times".
Swami said "They are all like bees drawn to the Lotus. You should not become like frogs near the lotus which do not realize it's value". He continued "Many of them have not even come to PN ( = Prashanti Nilayam, LH ), still they are devoted to me in the U.K.".
I mentioned "Swami, they have surrendered to you completely". Swami asked "What is surrender?" I said "Offering everything to you Swami". Swami said "Everything already belongs to me. What can you offer to me that is not mine? Living your life understanding that nothing is yours and everything belongs to Swami is surrender".
He then continued "Now, in U.K., in the hotel the window curtains were good, the TV was good, you both liked them but did you bring them back with you when you came home? In the same way when you leave this temporary stay on earth, just as you did not take anything with you when you checked out of the hotel, remember you will not take anything with you. It is OK for you to enjoy what is there in the hotel remembering all the time that you cannot take them with you when you leave for going home."
Suddenly he said sternly in Telugu "In Switzerland, when that old woman told that I appear in front of her, you thought that she was mad (Picchi). What do you know? What she said
is true. I go to her and communicate with her every week." He had again revealed His omnipresence and omniscience.
Swami in this form resurrected my mother who was dead. My aged mother was dead and the body had gone cold. My father was alone then with my mother and I was in a different location 2 hours away. When I messaged Madhu to inform Swami, Madhu told me that Swami was negative in his answer and that He had said that it was over.
Swami told someone who was with him at Muddenahalli (through Madhu) that "VijayaSai's mother has just passed away." He even told Narasimhamurthy sir that my mother had passed away. Around the same time, my father who was beside my mother confirmed to me that it was over and the body had completely cold.
Swami then mentioned to the people in His presence "Paapam, I will go there and see VijayaSai's mother right now". He then disappeared from Madhu's presence. Madhu messaged me about this. Exactly a minute later, my mother opened her eyes.
In his speech a few days later, Swami mentioned about the incident of Draupadi how she had torn a piece of her saree to use in as a bandage for Krishna's cut finger, and how that same piece became akshaya or multiplied infinitely as her saree when she was being disrobed.
He mentioned that VijayaSai's account was over. He knew that this situation would come and made me do something for Him so that He can return the favour by resurrecting my mother. He later spoke to my mother and said that He had resurrected her as He wanted her to see the glory of His avatar ahead.
A few months back, I was told of one more incident. As I have not directly heard it from them, there might be some minor inaccuracies in the details. I will narrate here my version of the incident. Dr.Ram Shetty had a severe heart attack and had passed away in the U.S. His wife desperately called Narasimhamurthy sir and asked him to inform Swami. Over 3 hours had passed. Here, Madhu mentioned that he saw both Dr.Rama Shetty and Swami together in His presence.
When warden sir mentioned to Swami about the call, Swami asked warden sir to call his wife and ask her what she wanted. She said that she wanted her husband to live. Swami asked Dr. Rama Shetty's subtle body which was with him to return and there in the U.S., Dr.Rama Shetty sat up on the bed alive.
Another person claimed that He revealed his omnipresence to him through Madhusudan. He said that it happened twice, once when he was in his house, and once in the office. He got a call from Madhusudan telling him that this is happening right now and that he needs to choose one particular option and speak a particular thing to someone which was 100% accurate. He said that if he had taken the other choice he would have been in problem now.
Another person claimed that he had a doubt if it is Swami and if Madhusudan is only reading his mind. He wanted to know if minor facts about something that is yet to happen could be told by Madhusudan. He said that the next moment, Madhusudan told him that "Swami is telling me that he understands your doubt. He has said that this person "A" will now come here in a few minutes and tell you "these words" exactly ".
This person thought it was a tall claim because the person named was not known to Madhusudan and was supposed to be out of town that day. In a few minutes this person "A" walked in and told those exact "words".
Another alumni claimed that what Swami had told him and his mother in their first interview when he was 6 was repeated by Madhusudan reminding the boy.
Another person said M told him that a fact that had happened when he was a baby which even he did not know and later verified from his mother as in my case.
Another senior esteemed active person in the Sai circles told that Madhusudan started communicating exactly from the point where he had left in his last interview in 2009. He also questioned him about the water project he had asked him to do.
Another person claimed that he was seriously ill and in the hospital and could not move. Madhusudan said that Swami had sent a chocolate to him as prasadam and he will be alright. This person was in Muddenahalli that evening and spoke about this experience saying that it was a healing miracle.
2 people I spoke to, one old student and one devotee told me that they could see Swami walking in front of Madhu. They could hear him communicate first in the darshan line which was then repeated by Madhu to the particular devotee. These same people told that even during a discourse Swami was on the chair and Madhu was communicating looking at Swami and they could hear every word. I too have seen Swami in the subtle form twice.
I have seen resurrection, healing, omnipresence, omniscience, omnipotence and love and am convinced that it is 100% Swami.
Finally after His 90th birthday when another alumnus and I were discussing, I realized that I too have personally improved in my personal sadhana and behaviour in the last few years. I have become much more patient, tolerant and loving than I ever was. I am able to accept people as they are without judging them. So, our association with the subtle form has in no way taken us away from Him or made us worse than before. I however respect your views and those of others who do not believe in this form as you have your own justifications and reasons. Let us in this situation agree to disagree with each others' views and experiences
Question - Should we use a medium to connect to swami?
None of us should use a medium. We need to connect and communicate directly with Swami in our hearts. This situation was the same even when Swami was in the physical body but we still came to see Him and talk to Him. This phenomenon is the same as that of Swami in the physical body. The physical form or the subtle form is only what we connect to because we are not able to have an inner connection with Him all the time.
Swami said "Madhu's is just a demonstration that if one can have this experience, all can have it too. Unless one has gone and seen the world how would he tell others that other places exist? Staying in India we can't see America but we get to know about it only if someone who has been to America tells us or we ourselves go ourselves there. Therefore, he is demonstrating that this is possible for everyone to have a connection".
Now about the phenomenon: When I asked Swami as to why He had to leave His physical body at 85, when He had said that He would continue till 96, the summary of His answer
was as follows. This has been compiled from the various initial interactions I have had with Him in the subtle form and not as one single session. I am only capturing the gist of it and it is not verbatim. Also, some of it is lost in the translation from Telugu to English:
"Earth is a school. We are divine beings who have come down for a human experience. In each class, the teachers are different. In each life, we choose parents and other people in our life who become our teachers. In this plane (I understood it as 3D where there is a concept of time and space), there is karma. Nobody can escape Karma. The rules are different there (I understood as above the Bardo or the 5th Dimension where we have our higher self). Whenever devotees who had various health disorders and diseases prayed to me for succour and help, I took on their diseases on my body and saved them. I cannot but respond when my devotees pray to me to save them. As I took on the diseases and disorders of my devotees, my body became weak. I could not function as I wanted to in order to complete everything I had planned for the Sathya Sai avatar. When my body became so weak that I had to depend on others for everything, I decided to give up the body.
I will be continuing without my body to fulfil all the words and promises I had given to people in this subtle form which is just without the physical body but same in all other aspects. I am not in my Para Sukshma Shareera by which I am omnipresent and all pervading. I am not in my Athi Sukshma Shareera through which I appear in dreams, visions and meditations of devotees. I am in my Sukshma Shareera which is 100% Swami, just without my physical body.
I will be completing whatever I had planned for this avatar in this subtle form. My mission will continue like the flow of Ganges. You can choose to be a part of it or not be a part of it but you can't stop the flow of Ganges."
I asked: "Swami but you are God, you are the Divine, why did you need to take on the diseases of others? Couldn't you just neutralize them?"
Swami said "I am the principal of the school of earth. If I don't follow the rules of the school, how will others follow? I need to set an ideal, a role model by following the rules myself. Nothing can be neutralized here without someone else taking it. I had therefore taken them on myself and it affected my physical body."
"Swami, why were you hospitalized for so many days? Why did you not leave immediately when you decided to leave?" I asked. Swami said "I wanted to prepare everyone mentally. Otherwise, people would have been so shocked that many wouldn't have lived. I prepared them slowly in stages. They accepted that I am in the hospital. They accepted that I am in ICU. They got ready mentally step by step that Swami also could leave His body. After leaving my body this way itself people talk so many things. What would have happened to my caretakers and others if I had suddenly decided one day to leave my body directly from the Yajur Mandir? So, this drama of the hospital was a necessary divine plan."
"Swami, why can't I see the Sukshma Shareera?" I asked. Swami said: "Who told you that you can't?
Take the example of a lake. For you to see the bottom of the lake, two things need to happen. The first one is that the water should be pure without any mud or impurity. The second one is that the water should be still without any movement. Develop purity of your mind and make your mind still and calm and then you can see me."
"Swami, but I want to communicate with you now", I said. He replied "OK. Ask me a question?" I asked him a question mentally. "Now the first answer you heard was this (he told me what the voice said). The second voice was this. Correct?" He asked. I said "Yes", Swami. He continued "The first voice was mine. The second was your mind.
Ask me one more question." I asked and again Swami pointed out which was His voice and which was the creation of my mind. He said, "it is like a TV transmission. You first get the voice. When you tune in more, you can see the image hazily. When you tune in even more you can see it clearly in colour. Yes. You connect to me directly. Why do you want to depend on others? Remember, earlier Darshan itself was meditation. Now in meditation is my darshan. You need to practice doing it. Make it a habit of connecting to me all the time."
"Swami, now I have one more question." I said. "Why did you not go to the other places of yours but to this place?" He replied "What to do? (Emi Chesedi) In all these places they have locked the doors of my bedrooms in PN, in Brindavan and in Kodaikanal. It was only here that people believe that I am there. They have kept my room open, change my robes every day, they serve breakfast, lunch, dinner every day, they clean the room every day, serve fresh drinking water every day.
But Swami "You don't have a body, why do you need breakfast, lunch, dinner, and water?". Swami said "When your father does the ceremonies (day of offering done every year to departed souls) to your grandfather and grandmother, do they come and eat the food? Yes they do. They come in their subtle forms and partake the subtle aspects of the food and water. Food and water too have subtle forms.
Similarly, when Naivedyam or consecrated offering is done to God in the temples, does the food disappear? No. God partakes the subtle form of the food and it becomes prasadam. In the same way, I am in my Sukshma shareera. I need a place to dwell as before as I am the same minus the physical body."
"Swami, why do you need a car?" I asked. I would need to submit here that earlier Madhu would come normally in his car and Swami would appear at the appointed time and start communicating using him as an instrument. Swami answered "I don't need one. When I go to other places, I travel via the akaasha maarga (meaning etheric route). Because the rest of you can't see and you want to feel my presence, how will you know that I have come in my subtle body? I use the car so that you know."
More importantly, if swami said He will be here till 96 years then His word has to be true isn't it? If swami said He would visit foreign countries, then His word has to be true. Isn't it? What is the other way to explain this? No ghost has ever possessed someone and built hospitals and schools in the name of someone else. Swami in His subtle form is everything that his avatar represented minus flesh and bones (a physical body). You have to experience it to understand it. His Jeeva Prajnya which is the identification with a particular name and form is as earlier along with Daiva Prajna ( divine consciousness).
Swami has also told us repeatedly even now. "Connect to me in your heart. Don't depend on others. Earlier in PN, you were attached to my physical form. It was a drama. Now here you are attached to the Subtle form. This too is a drama. Realize that I am your antarayami, your antaraga Sai and your Hridaya Nivasi. Make your mind pure & still, staying in touch with me without depending on others."
So, brother, didn't you go to PN when Swami was in His physical form even though you knew that He was in your heart? Why? You knew that the same Lord in your heart was there physically. It was a different experience to be in His Divine presence. Don't you go now to the Samadhi and feel His Divine presence in a different way? If not, why would you travel to India now and not seek Him in your heart in the U.K.?
In the same way, I am aware that I can connect to Him & I connect to Him most of the time. I use the "instrument" Madhu only when I have a need. That is because He is still there now, without His physical body. Swami is still here just like He was there earlier. Nothing has changed. It is the same Sathya Sai whether you accept Him or not, whether you certify it or not.
Whoever has experienced the subtle form, believe in Him and are aware of this truth. Even Indulal Shahji saw Him on the chair talking to Madhu and Madhu repeating it. Even I have seen Him. There are so many who have. Although I can connect to Him directly, whenever I am undergoing stress and tension in my life, I do not have the purity and the stillness to see Him, communicate with Him and trust that it is an authentic experience. Until I evolve through sadhana to that level to be connected to Him all the time, I will need to keep coming to PN, Mdh, Shirdi, Brindavan etc. I will keep using the 'instrument' Madhu to communicate whenever I need guidance as it was when He was in His physical body and I needed crucial guidance.
With Love, VijaySai B.S.